Arguing With Feminists Does Not Cut It!
Here is somebody who agrees with me. Hey, I just LOVE IT when somebody agrees with me!!
Especially when, as here, the thing they agree with really, really bears repeating to all ends of the earth!!
http://tinyurl.com/2jeljz
Seriously: Victory can be ours if we can only learn to stop "debating" with feminists, and just GROW THE MOVEMENT and mobilize against them. It is SO much easier to persuade somebody who is receptive to your message and half-convinced already, than somebody who doesn't want to hear a word you're saying and never will!
Therefore seek ye those eager and ardent souls who are thirsting for the gospel that you bring!
Especially when, as here, the thing they agree with really, really bears repeating to all ends of the earth!!
http://tinyurl.com/2jeljz
Seriously: Victory can be ours if we can only learn to stop "debating" with feminists, and just GROW THE MOVEMENT and mobilize against them. It is SO much easier to persuade somebody who is receptive to your message and half-convinced already, than somebody who doesn't want to hear a word you're saying and never will!
Therefore seek ye those eager and ardent souls who are thirsting for the gospel that you bring!
posted by Fidelbogen at 8:12 PM
13 Comments:
I agree that ignoring the fluff generators is advisable. However, ignoring the feminists who have actionable power is not. The latter have to be neutralized.
Fidelbogen,
I agree with you that debating a feminist will never result in her changing her mind and going away from the exercise seeing the error of her thinking.
But there's much more to it than this, especially when debating in an open forum like the internet.
A debate between feminist and non-feminist is not solely an exchange between two individuals. It's an opportunity to pitch to a potentially large audience. Everyone who witnesses the exchange will hold views anywhere between completely hostile to completely friendly (I sometimes visit feminist sites and often see comments left by MRA friendly visitors - indeed, I am one myself).
I see debating feminists in the same light as advertising. It gets our message and demands for law reform before a wider and wider audience.
Even though a feminist won't accept what you say, it doesn't matter. When men say what they believe and call feminists on their bull-shit, at least two things happen. One, the feminists see that men are not afraid to stand up to them, Two, the taboo on masculist heresy is weakened - a taboo that isn't respected is one that isn't effective. Openly and repeatedly scorn feminist orthodoxy with sound, clear-headed reason, and the path forward becomes easier. Wear them down, so that they become thoroughly familiar with what we have to say and why. We are training and educating them in the process - who cares if they don't like it or agree? Our thinking is entering the culture from our mouths, and this we must persist in. While the hard-core feminists continue to resist, we still harvest the minds of those who are more inclined to agree with us - especially other men, who love to see contests between rivals and are inspired by mastery and victory.
Don't forget also that good fighting skills can only be arrived at by practice.
I say get out there and argue with them so that you learn their wiles, sharpen your wits and know the pitfalls.
Once one gets past raging and letting anger govern one's mood, effective advocacy begins.
Rob Case
Men Done Wrong By The Justice System
http://abcnews.go.com/US/popup?id=3090516&cont
The faces of 21 Men convicted falsely of Rape. On the allegations of Women. The FemNags have said nothing about the Honor Killings of two girls in Dallas. As though they never happened.
Case has a point. Little by little, we've got to make the questioning of feminist authority a valid option again in the eyes other men.
Some of the fembots make good online sparring partners, and great prep for those important real world "debates" in front of impressionable citizens.
If you get good enough, you might have your rhetorical KO preserved on YouTube:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=3lXUd7VxuSA
Remember gentlemen: hard in practice, easy in battle.
Counter-fem's point is equally valid though. The most important thing we can learn from the example of the feminists is that we must start from within. In other words, the most important thing we can do is spread the message to other men. We are not going to get anything done by trying to appeal to women. Our points are not just personal for them. They don't see themselves as standing to lose anything, and consequently do not care. In the end, most of them (who am I kidding? Damn near all of them) will not be driven to change by the rantings of a small group.
In the early days of second wave feminism, most men just brushed off feminist complaints as the rantings of a small, inconsequential group. Indeed, at the time, they were. For the most part, we laughed them off and ignored them. They spread their message with evangelical fervor, slowly infiltrating and dominating key positions of power and influence, gaining new converts, and growing their movement. When men finally started waking up, it was too late. The complaints of a small inconsequential group, were now the unholy roar of a powerful political movement. Now, men as a group did not have the option to ignore the feminists.
Some men, those "manginas" we lament so much, waved the white flag, drank the kool aid and fell right into lockstep with the aims of radical feminism. Most were smart enough to just pay lip service to the idea, but didn't have the courage or will to challenge it, and thus just tried to live with it. Others continued to try to screen out the reality of what had happened and went paying for their ignorance in court.
A small group of men however, saw the threat, saw the evil, and stood against it. These men were the beginning of the MRA movement.
It's our job to finish what they started, and see it through to completion.
We've got to drop the term MGTOW/MRA in sports forums, auto forums, MMA forums, poker forums, video game forums, fatherhood forums, military forums; whatever it takes, wherever we can be heard. We've got to go out where the other men are and get them informed, get them involved.
All throughout the anglosphere, there is a nameless undercurrent of frustration, resentment, and anger running deep inside the hearts of men of every age, race, occupation and class. This feeling that has no name is our secret weapon. All we have to do is connect the dots for these men, and our movement grows.
The worst form of oppression is unnamed oppression, as you can't organize to strike back at what you can't fully describe. If we can name and shed light on the oppressor, (name the beast - feminism, the matriarchy, etc), we give men the ablity to organize against it. Moreover, if we can show our fellow suffering bastards that they are not alone, we can achieve solidarity. Few things inspire courage and commitment the way a sense of brotherhood does. Lastly, if we spead the message far and wide, we gain members. If we have large numbers of men joining the movement, we have power. If we get most of the male population onboard, we have real power.
Then we can truly start having discussions with the feminists. By that point, they will have no choice but to listen.
@exB: Splendid comment. Kudos!
As I like to put it, we must awaken male political consciousness.
I have been sluggish these last days because I am SICK (with a very bad cold) and TIRED (due to the energy draining effect), so. . .
I am not so clever to be writing ze good stuffs. . . :(
Good comment! But "Anglosphere" ?
Da muß ich aber einmal ganz heftig widersprechen! ;-)
Forum Feminismuskritik
Forum Wieviel Gleichberechtigung verträgt das Land
Forum Feminismusdiskussion
Genderama Blog
[...]
So you see the "undercurrent of frustration" runs also inside the hearts of men speaking a different language than English... :)
@Michael: Yes, it is multilingual and international. I get visitors from nearly every country in Europe, and plenty of others from all around the world.
Oh how I wish that I could read German more than just barely!
However, I do read FRENCH extremely well. Fluently.
Know of any French blogs or websites contrary to feminism. . .?
The only French ones I know of are Canadian - Masculinisme and Content d'etre un gars.
Odd thing is, France is my second biggest source of readers after the US, followed by Canada, UK, Australia, Ireland and NZ (usually in that order).
There's a second small group of regular readers from the Netherlands, Finland and Greece, with random visitors from all over Europe.
Visitors from Latin America, Africa and Asia (excluding Japan and Hong Kong) are extremely rare.
@Rob: Yup, that IS odd about France as a visitor source: I get ONE regular visitor from France - that's it!
The USA accounts for about half of my visitors.
Other than that, my proportions are roughly the same as yours. Holland and Spain are especially regular sources for me.
Also, a small but steady number from Singapore and Malaysia.
Africa? Rare, but I've gotten visitors (sometimes repeat visitors) from almost every country - including places such as Somalia, Burkina Faso, Congo, Gambia, Cote d'Ivoire, Kenya, Nigeria and Lesotho.
Michael, I stand corrected.
This is truly a global issue.
I've noticed MRA blogs as far away as Japan, and I also see a bunch of them popping up in India.
There is no point in arguing with a sow. She isn't interested in logic or reason. Her "feelings" are all that she understands. Arguing with a sow is worse than useless.
Time to forget the sows, regard them as so much bacon and ham, and get on with taking care of MEN and the business of MEN.
Catch more of The World According to Bob at http://bobstruth.blogspot.com
Once somebody embraces Malignant Narcissism it is very difficult to get them Mentally well. According to Tammy Bruce Feminists prefer to wallow in Victimhood. Rather than to get well Mentally. It is much easier to Hate Men than to make their own lives bearable. Men have become a Scapegoat for the dysfunctional lives of AW. Nancy LeVant says the same thing.
Feminists engage in self deception. It is a self reenforcing delusion they must live. They are Darwin Award candidates.
Dear Fidelbogen,
Thanks for the link! (And the trolls that came with them!) They must have been watching me post the links I had copied in my bookmarks because one of them responded in an most unpleasnt fashion.
Dealing with Antifeminism by Suzanne MacNevin
I agree with your point becuase while getting our message out to the people who have no clue what's going on is important, I just don't know how much time we really have to debate the issues becuase things just keep getting progressively worse.
I'm still under the belife that if a strong, viable political thrid party base could be built here in the United States there's a good chance feminism could be done away with. At this point you have so many disenchanted voters that if there were a party established here in the States that appealed to enough people the Democrat's and Republican's would have to really compete for the electorate votes. (This could possibly mean a shift AWAY FROM feminism.)
I'm ready, willing, and able to do the grunt work necessary to help build a thrid party here in the states. My only problem is the finances necessary to do so.
But I guess until I win the lottery I'll have to settle for link bating and reposting old articles..
Anyway thanks again Fidelbogen
Mezz Mezzrow Jr.
U Not Gonna Like This
http://unotgonnalikethis.blogspot.com/
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