Go and See How It's Done!
Please go immediately and read the following. It is a post on a radical feminist blog (remember "Jen", the alleged MRA Expert?), and there is a long comment thread attached to it. When you are reading that thread, you will make the acquaintance of a commenter who calls himself 'D'. All I've got to say is that D is a world-class wizard! Watch him at work. See how he completely VAPORIZES all of the feminists in the vicinity and exposes them as a herd of ignorant jackasses. And note the invincible puerility and unsinkable stupidity of their reactions—they have been worsted in the worst way, and their immediate comeback is absolute stone-deaf denial, as if they had gone into shock. Watch them stick their fingers in their ears and sing "la-la-la-la-la". The education in feminist psychology alone will be priceless for you!
This material needs to be a standard MRA text. I would even say, required reading! Be sure to archive the post and the thread in PDF or other suitable format, and spread these all over the MRA universe! ;)
http://tinyurl.com/y8gwhn5
This material needs to be a standard MRA text. I would even say, required reading! Be sure to archive the post and the thread in PDF or other suitable format, and spread these all over the MRA universe! ;)
http://tinyurl.com/y8gwhn5
posted by Fidelbogen at 1:34 AM
31 Comments:
It is bizarre how they think that men have 'privilege'.
I mean really, there's not one thing I have achieved from just being male. The same goes for this D character, who had the gall to ask them to provide examples of how men might expect to receive privilege! Of course they didn't answer him.
Their responses ... were simply puerile.
As expected, out comes the 'misogyny' tag. Which is really shorthand for 'we don't like this, so we aren't going to listen'. A great example of this is the idiot who said that 'misogynist' and 'libertarian' are interchangeable terms. What? Don't these people love to prattle on about their educations? lol.
D simply had more patience than most MRAs.
I must say that I am thoroughly impressed. "D" is truly a Jedi debater, not that these ladies were much of a challenge, but the sheer clarity and logic was just undeniable. If it were me, I would have ended up quoting reams of statistics. But "D" was content merely to demonstrate the feminists' massive egos using only logic and deductive reasoning as his weapons of choice. And they resent him for it!
They actually ban him not for disagreeing, but for "not understanding." They cannot conceive that feminism is a political philosophy, and that the feminist interpretation of history and current reality is completely subjective (thus in the realm of opinion). It's actually funny, to watch them get their butts handed to them on a silver platter, using their very own statements against them.
I have nothing but admiration for "D," and will be imitating his detached but competent tactics in my own dealings with ideologues.
Learn from this, my friends!
. . .
Per Fidelbogen's suggestion, I have archived the entire thread in a PDF, which should come in handy if they author of that blog ever shuts it down:
http://www.misandryreview.com/pdf/FeministTakeDown.pdf
Btw, I've expanded on this in my most recent post ...
Whoa nelly, that was SICK (in a good way). D took every round without a flench, and didn't even return ad hominem insults, except when he said "same to you", and if you were going to call him on THAT, you'd HAVE to acknowledge the original insults from these... "commenters".
If I may analyze... D kept pressing the basic point, the basic point being the assumption or fact that supports all the other supported assumptions and conclusions. Well, they couldn't answer for their basic point, proof that D had "male privilege", they COULDN'T PROVE IT!!
If this really were "so far beneathe them", then in a few words, much fewer than they used to insult D, they could have just resolved it by stating the real reasons and citing the right proof. What did he (and we) get? "look it up yourself!", Even on MRA websites when I see this, I sweat a bit, a slight shock of worry strikes the back of my mind, because I know everything based off whatever is being debated is assumed on an unproven... "branch"? It could be wrong, and whoever just told whoever to "go look it up" WITHOUT EVEN PROVIDING A SOURCE doesn't actually believe in what they were arguing, they know they are going on an assumption and can't prove it to the base of the argument.
D was civil, patient, and a true force to be reckoned with. "Angry" can mislead you, and even set you up for a big fall if you don't know how to contain it (I think Angry Harry is a colder kind of angry, one that is cold and calculating). You may have noticed that few crossed him in the middle, mostly it was one-on-one serially, moving to another opponent every 2 posts or so. AS SOON AS HE WAS BLACKLISTED, they all move in to cheer, if there were any proof that they were intimidated by this guy (I presume he's Male) it's the fact that none of them had the guts to approach him themselves. None of them had the proof to prove any of their claims against him, it is all an assumption, and as we all know, a false assumption. Being Male has gotten me and every guy I know nothing.
A cold apathy for what they think was far more impervious than all the rage posts in the world, they couldn't write off the reasoning and undeniable truth that they saw when he said they were wrong. "jenn" (such a nice name wasted on such a dishonest hypocrit) admitted defeat the minute she grey listed him, and proved beyond all doubt how wrong she was when she black listed him.
I came, I saw, D conquered.
How do you manage to regularly visit those pits of hell, fidelbogen? If growing a beard is a good protective measure for such activities, I must consider that... ;-) Anyway I left a short comment there for voicing my discontent with the Church of Feminism, although I'm pretty sure it won't survive for long...
Michael, Michael, Michael. . . did you save a backup copy on your computer? You could have posted it here, you know. . . !
Not worth saving that entry over there for posterity...
Have you seen nowadays Jenn hurls insults at Disney figures? And gets applauded for it in the comments section. After Jenn has probably banned and blacklisted every dissenting poster from her blog, the only thing that's left for her is shouting at Disney princesses. Kind of amusing she can't ban and control the characters of her own imagination. Well maybe she even doesn't want to. Paper enemies (that never talk back) she can get worked up about any time she feels like it.
No chance reaching those wimmin with reason. Reason doesn't compute with them. Waste of time...
Wow. I'm amazed he had the stamina to keep up with the b.s. for that long. Too bad the post is so old or I would have lent him my support (as a woman). Man, i really can't stand feminists - they are just so STUPID and ridiculous!!!
Great find. This guy D has taught me more about effective debate in one set of exchanges than I think any other has. It was a slaughter, and glorious to watch.
I think it was his indifference to their provocations, and his patience at reading what they said in order to highlight the absurdity of their own language that set him apart. Nothing he said was angry, rude or contrived. He won the casual reader over with his simple elegance and faithfulness to basic, uncontroversial truths. Not once did he depart into MRA-speak.
As hard as they tried to push him into saying something they could demolish him with, he fell for none of it.
For such a rabidly irrational bunch of supremacists, that he managed to get as many comments in as he did before being banned is testament to his skill - and not once did he stoop to false agreement to last the distance.
A real master.
@Anon 6:10:
"As hard as they tried to push him into saying something they could demolish him with, he fell for none of it".
And that is the problem with most MRAs - they are too easily pushed into saying things that could be used to demolish them.
They lack rhetorical discipline, as I like to say. MRAs as individuals need it, and the Movement collectively needs it.
It was almost inevitable that he would be banned. Feminists champion a vast array of foregone conclusions which for decades have lacked critique, allowing them to calcify into dogma. They are incapable of seeing outside their narrow worldview.
I especially liked one of their claims that to be a libertarian is to practically be a misogynist.
Fidelbogen,
Maybe you should make a post about this, with examples of what things should and should not be said.
By PURE COINCIDENCE, I found even more from our good friend D, in the comments section of another silly blog ...
http://dirtyrottenfeminist.wordpress.com/2008/05/08/trolling-and-male-privilege/
"especially liked one of their claims that to be a libertarian is to practically be a misogynist."
Yup. I do believe that pumpkin took first prize at the fair!
@ Snark
I found this at the website and couldn't stop laughing. Oh, the irony is so palatable and sweet!
"She wants men to stop raping women. She's over the world scapgoating girls"
I saw that too, I just shook my head in mild bemusement and moved on.
@Michael:
"Have you seen nowadays Jenn hurls insults at Disney figures?"
Indeed I have. I too saw that post.
Again, we see how ignorant feminists themselves are (as a rule) of feminism itself.
In railing against those cartoon characters, Jenn is attacking the princess archetype.
Doesn't she realize that she is undermining the entire feminist enterprise by doing THAT??
We counter-feminists understand so much more about feminism than the feminists do, simply because we are able to SEE feminism in its entirety, in an objective and unfiltered way, in terms of its contradictions and its externalities.
Fidelbogen said...
@Anon 6:10:
"As hard as they tried to push him into saying something they could demolish him with, he fell for none of it".
And that is the problem with most MRAs - they are too easily pushed into saying things that could be used to demolish them.
They lack rhetorical discipline, as I like to say. MRAs as individuals need it, and the Movement collectively needs it.
6:57 PM
"
They lack rhetorical discipline, as I like to say. MRAs as individuals need it, and the Movement collectively needs it".
When will classes be taught?
Fidelbogen,
We have been standing far enough away from feminists to see the big picture. They individually cannot see it, perhaps like not being able to see the forest through the trees?
@anon 1:29:
"They individually cannot see it, perhaps like not being able to see the forest through the trees?"
BINGO! 'Feminist Subjectivism' is what I call that!
@Anon 12:59
Check the following, it pertains:
tinyurl.com/ya6sj8u
And this too:
tinyurl.com/yd3a7kg
@fidelbogen: I think she is railing against the submissive part of the princess archetype, not the "my social standing will give me a lot of power" part of it...
What do you mean by 'undermining the feminist enterprise' ? That she, by destroying the princess archetype, would rob feminism of one of its most useful enemies? No (imagined) enemy - no reason to act anymore - disorganisation sets in? They're never going to do that. In fact I wouldn't be surprised to find out feminists own Disney stocks and actively support the production of new Princess cartoons as a recruiting tool.
@Michael:
About the princess archetype: without the presence of this archetype, female supremacism (read: feminism) would flounder and collapse.
I'll let Snark explain it, HERE:
http://tinyurl.com/yjnuugf
Fidelbogen said...
@anon 1:29:
"They individually cannot see it, perhaps like not being able to see the forest through the trees?"
BINGO! 'Feminist Subjectivism' is what I call that!
@Anon 12:59
Check the following, it pertains:
tinyurl.com/ya6sj8u
And this too:
tinyurl.com/yd3a7kg
2:14 AM
Thank you, I have been neeind more good reading material. I'm going to be studying hard.
I'm late to the party, but that was good reading -- the usefulness of commenting on a feminist blog is usually debatable, but D's posts were useful in further exposing the intellectual bankruptcy of the people we're up against. As great as it was, what he did wasn't anything all that difficult; he basically just asked for something resembling a logical argument rather than the typical feminist tactic of asserting something and saying it's the opponent's job to provide the evidence. It's almost amusing how the female posters reacted to him -- or it would be, if these weren't the people who have the power to define the terms of the debate.
"And that is the problem with most MRAs - they are too easily pushed into saying things that could be used to demolish them."
Why should we care about what our enemies think? The only judgement that matters is our own.
Feminists don't need ammunition to "demolish" us; they simply launch endless adhominems and misrepresentations.
"Why should we care about what our enemies think? The only judgement that matters is our own."
That is precisely the attitude which got THEM into trouble. We would be wise not to take them as role models.
While I certainly don't "care" what they think (they can take a flyin' shit, man!), I most certainly DO understand the requirements of politics.
Remember that our real "constituency" is regular, normal non-feminist people, and if the feminists keep playing their tricks, and if we keep refusing to take the bait, then WE will shine by comparison in the eyes of the general public. . . .
So... loose cannon-mouth syndrome ain't gonna cut it, man!
snore. I couldn't even find the energy to read that entire thread. They were all just going on and on and on and it was like a battle to see who could use the biggest words. They are each no better than the others. Including D. I mean, these are blogs. The isolated opinions of a very small, select group of people on the fringes of society. He're's an idea. Get off the computers and live real lives. Try interacting with real people be they men or women. God. What a colossal waste of time.
@Bruce:
"They were all just going on and on and on and it was like a battle to see who could use the biggest words. They are each no better than the others. Including D."
Since the real point of all this escapes you, why should I take your remarks seriously?
"He're's an idea. Get off the computers and live real lives."
Don't make assumptions about other people's "real lives" when you have no "real" information about this.
Here's another PDF backup of this legendary teaching tool:
http://rapidshare.com/files/449423675/xxblaze_wordpress_com_2008_09_04_dear_jeebus_what_about_the.pdf
I used a different pdf conversion than the first commenter, so I think this PDF is superior (it actually has the website identically as is).
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